- Real Madrid beat Tottenham 4-0
- 4-0 defeat to Real Madrid
- real madrid vs tottenham pics.
- Real Madrid 4 Tottenham 0
- celebrated Real Madrid 4-0
- Real Madrid 4 – 0 Tottenham
- real madrid vs tottenham
- MADRID, SPAIN - APRIL 04:
- real madryt tottenham hotspur,
- Real Madrid gets the first
- Loja e pare: Real Madrid vs
- real madrid vs tottenham
- Real Madrid v Tottenham
- real madrid vs tottenham goals
- April 6, 2011: Real Madrid 4-0
- Superb Real Madrid overpower
- Real Madrid thrashed Tottenham
- Real Madrid v Tottenham
- real madrid vs tottenham
Funkymonk
Apr 19, 01:37 PM
Couldn't Samsung just claim that the Galaxy S line is an evolution of the Samsung F700? Pretty strong argument for samsung.
canucksfan88
Mar 26, 03:44 PM
does anyone else thing launchpad is the worst idea yet?
dscuber9000
Apr 28, 04:24 PM
Did you ask to see W's birth certificate, or any other president's birth certificate? Why not?
Well he's obviously American! Just look at him! ;)
Well he's obviously American! Just look at him! ;)
Dan==
Jul 27, 02:00 PM
The Mac name will never work! It's just too generic. And Apple must be suicidal if they keep a Core Solo in the Mini. The Core Solo will NOT be priced dropped and offers very poor value for money compared to a low-end Merom or mid-range Yonah (after price drop).
I can't say much about the name. I'm not the first to offer it. But nothing else comes to mind that seems to fit well.
For the Mini, I'd much rather see a Duo in the bottom of line unit, but let's face it, there's a lot of clamouring for the return of a sub $500 dollar unit, and a Core 2 Duo won't be in it, at least not in the next 6 months anyway. I'd personally like to see a $499 unit with a Core 2 Yonah, but suspect a Solo is all that will be affordable. For the rest of the Mini's, we should see 2MB cache Merom's. They're gonna be the same prices!
It's true, I haven't seen any price cuts in print for the Solo, but they simply can't be kept the same (when the other processors start shipping). But, true, this is an assumption.
Pretty cool, but it needs a real name, MAC won't cut it. Maybe Mac Express?
And it wouldn't have FW800 or a second optical slot. Probably a second HD slot instead. And I'd guess it would be more of a pizza box enclosure, but that's wild speculation. Your price is probably way too low, too.
Thanks!
I can't figure out why it wouldn't have a 2nd slot or FW800. They're both cheap enough to add. The only problem is the 2nd slot adds some height, but not that much. This unit would be less than 5" tall. And anyway, how do you backup your CD's? What a pain to go to the HD first! Adding another slot for a HD would be great, but I think that'll be one of the differentiators with the Pro. (Hey, maybe one or the other.)
As far the price goes, why does someone always have to resist? At this price there is plenty more profit here than the Mini.
Here's what I wrote in a thread over at 123macmini.com
http://www.123macmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6896&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15
However, these prices are, I think, pretty doable. They're based largely on what Apple already sells the Mini for. That cheaper Conroe processor is just about the same price as the Core Solo in the $600 Mini right now! (Well, when it was introduced, anyway.) 3.5" 160MB SATA drives are roughly the same price as 2.5" 60GB SATA drives, separate graphics are < $50, and I suspect that system slots, fans, FW800, and other interfaces wouldn't add more than $100 to the price of the system. (Think +$50 in profits over the Mini.)
That was before I included a number of things, including extra RAM, and a mouse/keyboard in the base model, and bumped the price $40. Also, the cheaper Conroe came out at $185 instead of $210 as was being considered.
I think a box like this at $999 would have $100 to $150 more profit than the Mini!
I can't say much about the name. I'm not the first to offer it. But nothing else comes to mind that seems to fit well.
For the Mini, I'd much rather see a Duo in the bottom of line unit, but let's face it, there's a lot of clamouring for the return of a sub $500 dollar unit, and a Core 2 Duo won't be in it, at least not in the next 6 months anyway. I'd personally like to see a $499 unit with a Core 2 Yonah, but suspect a Solo is all that will be affordable. For the rest of the Mini's, we should see 2MB cache Merom's. They're gonna be the same prices!
It's true, I haven't seen any price cuts in print for the Solo, but they simply can't be kept the same (when the other processors start shipping). But, true, this is an assumption.
Pretty cool, but it needs a real name, MAC won't cut it. Maybe Mac Express?
And it wouldn't have FW800 or a second optical slot. Probably a second HD slot instead. And I'd guess it would be more of a pizza box enclosure, but that's wild speculation. Your price is probably way too low, too.
Thanks!
I can't figure out why it wouldn't have a 2nd slot or FW800. They're both cheap enough to add. The only problem is the 2nd slot adds some height, but not that much. This unit would be less than 5" tall. And anyway, how do you backup your CD's? What a pain to go to the HD first! Adding another slot for a HD would be great, but I think that'll be one of the differentiators with the Pro. (Hey, maybe one or the other.)
As far the price goes, why does someone always have to resist? At this price there is plenty more profit here than the Mini.
Here's what I wrote in a thread over at 123macmini.com
http://www.123macmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6896&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15
However, these prices are, I think, pretty doable. They're based largely on what Apple already sells the Mini for. That cheaper Conroe processor is just about the same price as the Core Solo in the $600 Mini right now! (Well, when it was introduced, anyway.) 3.5" 160MB SATA drives are roughly the same price as 2.5" 60GB SATA drives, separate graphics are < $50, and I suspect that system slots, fans, FW800, and other interfaces wouldn't add more than $100 to the price of the system. (Think +$50 in profits over the Mini.)
That was before I included a number of things, including extra RAM, and a mouse/keyboard in the base model, and bumped the price $40. Also, the cheaper Conroe came out at $185 instead of $210 as was being considered.
I think a box like this at $999 would have $100 to $150 more profit than the Mini!
Digitaljim
Nov 28, 08:05 PM
So Universal Music Group must have received something in the region of $112 so far from Zune sales.
sampdoria
Jun 15, 03:02 PM
What a cluster F it was at Radio Shack.
It was just my friend and I on line. Nobody else.
Was there for 30 minutes before I left for work
leaving them with my name. My friend stayed
an additional 30 minutes.
They could not generate a pin. System kept
rejecting their request. Finally we were told they
were out of pins.
Meanwhile, I still see posts about some of you
getting PIN numbers.
Sorry to hear NJRonbo. I was back and forth between going to Apple and RS. But the RS salesperson last night, persuaded me to give him a try, and he would throw in a $50 gift card on top of my crappy trade-ins (good salesman), because I was going for 2 iphone4s. If it didn't work, then go to Apple.
So I decided this morning to try my luck with him. I was the only person in the store asking for the new iphone at 1pm, in the middle of urban cambridge (boston), believe it or not. Patience was key here. He started my order right at 1pm, but got declined like 20 times. I went back to my work an hour later. And he calls me around 2:45pm to say that he has two pins for 32GB iphone4s for me! As far as he knows, they will be available on launch day. With all the uncertainties that have been said on this thread, I won't hold my breath for launch day, but I do appreciate the discounts and trade-ins. So, I say good deal in any case.
He told me he got calls from DM's about there being still plenty of inventory an hour after the start, but because everyone was accessing the central server at once, it was jamming up. It took 2hrs and 45 mins to get my order processed.
I'm pretty satisfied (or lucky) so far, even though the process is so f'd up. I don't think RS intentionally does it this way, but hey it is what it is, for this once in a few years.
It was just my friend and I on line. Nobody else.
Was there for 30 minutes before I left for work
leaving them with my name. My friend stayed
an additional 30 minutes.
They could not generate a pin. System kept
rejecting their request. Finally we were told they
were out of pins.
Meanwhile, I still see posts about some of you
getting PIN numbers.
Sorry to hear NJRonbo. I was back and forth between going to Apple and RS. But the RS salesperson last night, persuaded me to give him a try, and he would throw in a $50 gift card on top of my crappy trade-ins (good salesman), because I was going for 2 iphone4s. If it didn't work, then go to Apple.
So I decided this morning to try my luck with him. I was the only person in the store asking for the new iphone at 1pm, in the middle of urban cambridge (boston), believe it or not. Patience was key here. He started my order right at 1pm, but got declined like 20 times. I went back to my work an hour later. And he calls me around 2:45pm to say that he has two pins for 32GB iphone4s for me! As far as he knows, they will be available on launch day. With all the uncertainties that have been said on this thread, I won't hold my breath for launch day, but I do appreciate the discounts and trade-ins. So, I say good deal in any case.
He told me he got calls from DM's about there being still plenty of inventory an hour after the start, but because everyone was accessing the central server at once, it was jamming up. It took 2hrs and 45 mins to get my order processed.
I'm pretty satisfied (or lucky) so far, even though the process is so f'd up. I don't think RS intentionally does it this way, but hey it is what it is, for this once in a few years.
darkplanets
Mar 31, 10:56 PM
You mean AntennaGates 1 & 2, iOS 4 on iPhone 3G, the light bleeding on the iPads before shipping, the Macbook Airs crashing when using iTunes aren't examples of Apple cutting corners to get a product to release? I will buy Mac probably for the rest of my life so long as the company is in business and putting out great products with great operating systems.
And they didn't spin it perfectly. Steve Jobs told consumers they were holding the phone wrong and pretended the problem would go away.
I feel like Apple fails more on the hardware front than the software front, especially with the iDevices. Regardless, both companies have flaws, but having your next gen OS NOT work on phones is a big uh-oh. Obviously they'll optimize it; perhaps they'll skip honeycomb for phones, and then come out with a unified "faster" approach for both tablets and phones.
And they didn't spin it perfectly. Steve Jobs told consumers they were holding the phone wrong and pretended the problem would go away.
I feel like Apple fails more on the hardware front than the software front, especially with the iDevices. Regardless, both companies have flaws, but having your next gen OS NOT work on phones is a big uh-oh. Obviously they'll optimize it; perhaps they'll skip honeycomb for phones, and then come out with a unified "faster" approach for both tablets and phones.
eeboarder
Jul 27, 02:29 PM
Actually, the merom in not completely compatible with the yonah chips. There will have to be some redesign on Apple's part that is supposed to delay the new MBPs. This article somewhat explains it:
http://blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=249
Also, since Apple is now kind of competeing with PCs who get the newest and fastest, it would be in Apple's best interest to get these chips in MBPs asap. Also, it is easy to see that a lot of people are waiting to purchase a new Apple laptop with this technology. MBP's current sales are going to slump from here on out until this technology is put into some new computers.
http://blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=249
Also, since Apple is now kind of competeing with PCs who get the newest and fastest, it would be in Apple's best interest to get these chips in MBPs asap. Also, it is easy to see that a lot of people are waiting to purchase a new Apple laptop with this technology. MBP's current sales are going to slump from here on out until this technology is put into some new computers.
Shasterball
Apr 19, 01:58 PM
Parties do not understate potential damages in a lawsuit. No way. No how.
jholzner
Jul 27, 10:42 AM
Sorry if i missed it, but at what speeds do these run? Don't they know just because they keep bumping and bumping the chip speed don't really mean they have a faster system. Seem just like yesterday when a better design was more important than a super fast chip. Oh well, everyone is buying into the Mhz myth now. Funny that just a year or so ago, Apple was trying to shoot down the Mhz myth, now they have people cheering for it. I guess power consumption is good though.
If you read the linked articled you will find the answer.
Also, right from the macrumors page is a quote that says, "Core 2 Duo runs at slower clock speeds than Pentium-era chips, but is still more productive because it handles more calculations per clock cycle." I think that would show that this has nothing to do with the Mhz myth but is the opposite.
If you read the linked articled you will find the answer.
Also, right from the macrumors page is a quote that says, "Core 2 Duo runs at slower clock speeds than Pentium-era chips, but is still more productive because it handles more calculations per clock cycle." I think that would show that this has nothing to do with the Mhz myth but is the opposite.
steadysignal
Apr 11, 12:22 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)
I dont want to wait :(
who does? but it will be worth it...
I dont want to wait :(
who does? but it will be worth it...
AdeFowler
Aug 26, 05:47 AM
How depressing :o
It seems to me that there are very few clear policies at Apple Support; it often depends on who you talk to. For example;
my 15" PowerBook had a stuck red pixel. I rang Apple and the guy said "Sorry but that's within acceptable limits (for Apple)". I put the phone down and rang again. The next guy said it was totally unacceptable and insisted on sending me a new machine.
I'm on the verge of getting a friend to buy a MacBook but I'm seriously scared, having preached to her for years about Apple's legendary quality and support.
If you're reading this Steve, spend your next $100m on staff training ;)
It seems to me that there are very few clear policies at Apple Support; it often depends on who you talk to. For example;
my 15" PowerBook had a stuck red pixel. I rang Apple and the guy said "Sorry but that's within acceptable limits (for Apple)". I put the phone down and rang again. The next guy said it was totally unacceptable and insisted on sending me a new machine.
I'm on the verge of getting a friend to buy a MacBook but I'm seriously scared, having preached to her for years about Apple's legendary quality and support.
If you're reading this Steve, spend your next $100m on staff training ;)
the.snitch
Aug 7, 06:58 PM
Holy crap, Time machine looks amazing! I'm happy with all the other features, about on-par with what I expect. That french dude in the presentation really made Microsoft look like fools - infact, just this iteration of OS X seems to add more features than Vista adds over XP. I'm looking forward to leopard, and I wonder what the "Top Secret" features are, that are yet-to-be-revealed.
Cowinacape
Jul 23, 05:32 PM
Multimedia, I'd love to see a line up like that released, dual 2.3 here I come :D here's hoping that your predictions are close to the mark!
extraextra
Aug 26, 09:24 PM
The update time for Apple's store is 9am EST? I was under the impression that it was 9am PST. I'm behind the times! (pun intended, I suppose)
Is the 7-10 days for BTO iMacs? Or stock ones?
Is the 7-10 days for BTO iMacs? Or stock ones?
marksman
Mar 31, 09:04 PM
As an Apple fanboy, I'm disappointed to post this, but Android will continue to win despite the huge fragmentation problem.
Unlike Windoze based computers, cell phone users expect to replace their phones minimally every two years. So for the most part these users just don't care whether the manufacturers bother to upgrade the OS or whether the few apps they've found need to be repurchased.
When they go shopping and see a brand new Android phone running a better OS with more apps than they had before, they will simply buy it. Especially since there will continue to be two for one offers and lots of competition.
Like Apple computers, iPhones will be superbly engineered, but that hasn't mattered in the computer arena and it won't matter in the cell phone arena.
BTW, I expect Apple to eventually command 20% of the world's computer, cell phone, and tablet market with 50% (or more) of the profits, so it's not like Apple won't be successful. It's like combining all of the luxury cars together under one manufacturer.
I disagree because Smartphones have become essentially computers for people, and people much more than ever want to maintain their existence when they upgrade or move on. With the iPhone this is simply easy to just get a new model of iphone and continue on. Crossing from one manufacturer of android to another with a new OS and everything else, I can't believe it is anywhere near as seamless or effortless.
I think mostly what we are seeing in the marketplace now is the android is for people who can't afford an iPhone. Other people mentioned the two for one deals and other things. It is just a marketplace where android based phones are more affordable and accessible to people who don't have as much to spend on a smartphone.
The whole android handset is crazy. Manufacturers make up new models every 3 weeks, Google renames each version of the Android operating system with some silly name... There is no cohesion or continuity in that at all. I think consumers look more for that than ever.
Android has barely been out long enough for most of the normal consumers to be on an upgrade path already and to have to cycle into a new device. Time will tell.
I think people will see a new android handset (although aqain it is confusing with 25 different makers), and expect to be able to just take it home and upgrade it.. But is that how it happens? Because it is like 2 clicks for an iPhone.
Unlike Windoze based computers, cell phone users expect to replace their phones minimally every two years. So for the most part these users just don't care whether the manufacturers bother to upgrade the OS or whether the few apps they've found need to be repurchased.
When they go shopping and see a brand new Android phone running a better OS with more apps than they had before, they will simply buy it. Especially since there will continue to be two for one offers and lots of competition.
Like Apple computers, iPhones will be superbly engineered, but that hasn't mattered in the computer arena and it won't matter in the cell phone arena.
BTW, I expect Apple to eventually command 20% of the world's computer, cell phone, and tablet market with 50% (or more) of the profits, so it's not like Apple won't be successful. It's like combining all of the luxury cars together under one manufacturer.
I disagree because Smartphones have become essentially computers for people, and people much more than ever want to maintain their existence when they upgrade or move on. With the iPhone this is simply easy to just get a new model of iphone and continue on. Crossing from one manufacturer of android to another with a new OS and everything else, I can't believe it is anywhere near as seamless or effortless.
I think mostly what we are seeing in the marketplace now is the android is for people who can't afford an iPhone. Other people mentioned the two for one deals and other things. It is just a marketplace where android based phones are more affordable and accessible to people who don't have as much to spend on a smartphone.
The whole android handset is crazy. Manufacturers make up new models every 3 weeks, Google renames each version of the Android operating system with some silly name... There is no cohesion or continuity in that at all. I think consumers look more for that than ever.
Android has barely been out long enough for most of the normal consumers to be on an upgrade path already and to have to cycle into a new device. Time will tell.
I think people will see a new android handset (although aqain it is confusing with 25 different makers), and expect to be able to just take it home and upgrade it.. But is that how it happens? Because it is like 2 clicks for an iPhone.
georgi0
Sep 19, 12:54 AM
.. i am wondering if the price of the current line of MB and MBP will drop or it will stay the same and it will be replaced by shiping out MEROM laptops.
thanks..
thanks..
ksz
Sep 20, 04:11 PM
The only real downside I see is that Intel Macs are unlikely to hold their value anywhere near as well as the PPC line did due to the quicker changes we'll see now.
I keep systems til they fall apart, pretty much, but there's quite a few on the various forums who say they always buy and sell 2-3 years later to upgrade.
I should have been more thorough in my previous reply. What I really like about these frequent updates are the following:
1. The motherboard has socketed processors (except for the laptops).
2. Even though Intel is updating processors every 6 months or so, the motherboard and chipset seem to support the next processor version.
Yonah can be replaced with Merom.
Woodcrest can be replaced with Clovertown.
Your computer does not become obsolete in 6 months. Instead, it gains new life if you decide that you need the new processor.
Every 12 to 18 months or so a new chipset may become necessary. Only then does your computer lose the upgrade potential. If you buy Merom, you may not be able to upgrade to the next processor. Likewise if you buy Clovertown. New chipsets will be required beyond Merom and Clovertown.
In any event, this is based on trailing history of just 1 year. Future events may unfold differently.
I keep systems til they fall apart, pretty much, but there's quite a few on the various forums who say they always buy and sell 2-3 years later to upgrade.
I should have been more thorough in my previous reply. What I really like about these frequent updates are the following:
1. The motherboard has socketed processors (except for the laptops).
2. Even though Intel is updating processors every 6 months or so, the motherboard and chipset seem to support the next processor version.
Yonah can be replaced with Merom.
Woodcrest can be replaced with Clovertown.
Your computer does not become obsolete in 6 months. Instead, it gains new life if you decide that you need the new processor.
Every 12 to 18 months or so a new chipset may become necessary. Only then does your computer lose the upgrade potential. If you buy Merom, you may not be able to upgrade to the next processor. Likewise if you buy Clovertown. New chipsets will be required beyond Merom and Clovertown.
In any event, this is based on trailing history of just 1 year. Future events may unfold differently.
monster620ie
Apr 5, 08:57 PM
4K is coming sooner than later. Youtube has 4K media, of course it looks bad because of the YT compression penalty.
4K displays are coming too, both computer monitors and home theater.
are there any 4K tv's out ?
Red Scarlet + 4K tv (how sweet it would be. oh well, I can dream on i guess) :rolleyes:
4K displays are coming too, both computer monitors and home theater.
are there any 4K tv's out ?
Red Scarlet + 4K tv (how sweet it would be. oh well, I can dream on i guess) :rolleyes:
terkans
Jul 20, 11:04 AM
2nd generation intel Mac Pro...
8 cores...
2^3 = 8
Mac Pro 2 Cubed
[cue 'return of the cubes']
8 cores...
2^3 = 8
Mac Pro 2 Cubed
[cue 'return of the cubes']
gnasher729
Aug 17, 05:32 AM
They are comparing a 2 generations old G5 (Dual 2,5) versus a new Intel (Quad 2,6) which is not even the fastest out there. What kind of comparison is that?
If you want to know what is the fastest Mac, the comparison is no good. If you want to know whether you should upgrade your machine, the comparison makes a lot of sense. First, the 2.66 GHz Quad has the best price/performance ratio. If you start with the 2.0 GHz, you get 666 MHz more for $300, then you get another 333 MHz for a mere $800. So if you want to upgrade, the 2.66 is _the_ machine to buy. Second, there will be much less difference between a Quad G5 and a Quad Xeon. On performance critical Rosetta applications (like Photoshop) the Quad G5 will be stronger. In that case, it doesn't matter how much stronger - you won't upgrade, that is all that matters. But if you have a dual G5, then the question whether to upgrade or not is really interesting.
And we need to know whether apps use four cores or not. In many cases, changing from two threads to four threads is very easy (that is if all the threads to the same work; it is much harder if the threads do different work), but the app uses only two threads because most machines had only two CPUs. As an example, early versions of Handbrake didn't gain anything from Quad G5s; the CPUs were 50% idle all the time. People complained, and it was changed. The same thing will happen again, especially since _all_ Mac Pros have four cores.
If you want to know what is the fastest Mac, the comparison is no good. If you want to know whether you should upgrade your machine, the comparison makes a lot of sense. First, the 2.66 GHz Quad has the best price/performance ratio. If you start with the 2.0 GHz, you get 666 MHz more for $300, then you get another 333 MHz for a mere $800. So if you want to upgrade, the 2.66 is _the_ machine to buy. Second, there will be much less difference between a Quad G5 and a Quad Xeon. On performance critical Rosetta applications (like Photoshop) the Quad G5 will be stronger. In that case, it doesn't matter how much stronger - you won't upgrade, that is all that matters. But if you have a dual G5, then the question whether to upgrade or not is really interesting.
And we need to know whether apps use four cores or not. In many cases, changing from two threads to four threads is very easy (that is if all the threads to the same work; it is much harder if the threads do different work), but the app uses only two threads because most machines had only two CPUs. As an example, early versions of Handbrake didn't gain anything from Quad G5s; the CPUs were 50% idle all the time. People complained, and it was changed. The same thing will happen again, especially since _all_ Mac Pros have four cores.
Krevnik
Apr 27, 09:19 AM
Are you somehow trying to imply that because the credit card company knows so much about you that it is OK to keep that information unencrypted on your phone and backup on your computer?
All people are asking for is that personal information is kept encrypted and secured. No more. No less.
Apple provides the option of encrypting your backups. I suggest that anyone concerned about the safety of their personal information use this feature.
Can you trust anyone to completely cover their bases correctly on this issue? Their "meh" data might be your "personal" data. The only way to be certain that the backups are encrypted is to encrypt the whole backup. Doesn't lengthen the time it takes much either, and you get to set the password to use/access the backup.
Yes, Apple made a bone-head move here. But there's a lot more personal information floating in the backups. SMS message history, 3rd party app data, etc. Not all of it is encrypted, and some of it you probably want encrypted.
All people are asking for is that personal information is kept encrypted and secured. No more. No less.
Apple provides the option of encrypting your backups. I suggest that anyone concerned about the safety of their personal information use this feature.
Can you trust anyone to completely cover their bases correctly on this issue? Their "meh" data might be your "personal" data. The only way to be certain that the backups are encrypted is to encrypt the whole backup. Doesn't lengthen the time it takes much either, and you get to set the password to use/access the backup.
Yes, Apple made a bone-head move here. But there's a lot more personal information floating in the backups. SMS message history, 3rd party app data, etc. Not all of it is encrypted, and some of it you probably want encrypted.
topmounter
Apr 6, 10:37 AM
"integrated graphics"... "good enough" LOL... I think I'll keep my current-gen 13" MBA. I didn't buy the world's most expensive netbook for "good enough".
wpotere
Apr 28, 06:45 AM
Wow, this thread and the ridiculous nature of this issue are hilarious. Seriously, you wonder why the US is going down the pan when the entire nation seems to get caught up in a fight over a bloody birth certificate?
Amusing isn't it?
Amusing isn't it?
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